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Rubber bullets (Read 1797 times)
old codger
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Rubber bullets
Jan 27th, 2012 at 11:45pm
 
Heard a story on the TV news tonight of a home owner in Portland who shot a late night visitor with rubber bullets from his shotgun cause he didn't want to kill anybody.  He said the first three rounds were rubber and the next were full 12 ga buckshot.  Interesting story. 
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M1911A1 Steve
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Re: Rubber bullets
Reply #1 - Jan 28th, 2012 at 1:04am
 

I think that rubber bullets are a good idea, but I would only use very hard rubber. Maybe with a lead core.  Roll Eyes
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electric cowboy
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Re: Rubber bullets
Reply #2 - Jan 28th, 2012 at 9:22am
 
I have often thought of use of rubber slugs or shot, and bean bag type rounds in the pump 12ga. for the first round.
But I keep coming back to the Idea that the intruder entered my home while I was there, with out my permission.
This means only one thing to me. That they came to harm me. or even kill me or my family. So knowing that, do I really want a non effective round In the shotgun?
I could see where the non lethal rounds may be useful against one intruder, but multiple intruders is another thing.
I know the bean bag type round can knock a man down, but he is going to get back up right?
Maybe that's the problem I have with non lethal forms of protection. They get back up madder then what they were.

Would love to figure out a test to show the force (knock down power) that these non lethal rounds would have.
surely some one has done the test.

Note: maybe I am looking at it wrong. If one were to shoot the intruder with a non lethal round first before the use of lethal force, would this help in court to prove you were not trying to kill but to stop?
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RickO
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Re: Rubber bullets
Reply #3 - Jan 28th, 2012 at 10:33am
 
No way would I consider non-lethal rounds.. you may get only one shot.  Actual cases of perps on PCP show that multiple rounds do not stop them.  Nor do I believe that they will be knocked down by a bean bag... maybe because it hurts, they react.  Laws of physics say different.  Of course, movies and TV feed this belief, with a pistol round blowing a crook through a window etc... just Hollywood stuff. I want stopping power.
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Re: Rubber bullets
Reply #4 - Jan 28th, 2012 at 12:31pm
 
I'm with E.C on this.  Somebody breaking into my home when I am there made the decision that he will take me on if I come out of the bedroom to investigate.  He entered my home prepared to fight me/overcome me if necessary.

At 61 years old and and needing a cane, to get around, as humane as rubber/non-lethal rounds may be.....I won't trust my life, my wife's life or my cat's life (yes....I have a cat) to rubber bullets, unless Steve rolled me a few of his lead-core ones.
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electric cowboy
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Re: Rubber bullets
Reply #5 - Jan 28th, 2012 at 1:44pm
 
I did a search on video's for rubber bullets and came up with some youtube video's of people shooting each other with them.
(kids do not do this)

not about to post the video's of these idiot's.
lets just say a normal size man being hit with a bean bag from a 12ga. shell, in the middle of the back. at 15 feet or greater, does not go down.
I also found video of use of some rubber bullets that had a steal ball in side  and some with a brass cup around them.
some deaths were reported from use of this type rubber bullets. what were they thinking. (I don't get the point of this type of rubber bullet)

all in all I am going to stick with normal ammo. Wink

One note: there is a rubber bullet one can reload into just a case and primer (no powder) for training when shooting paper targets.
It will not cycle the action on a auto, but would be great in a revolver. If one could not go to the range and wanted to work on trigger control, then this round could be used in the basement or garage. not much of a bang, just a pop.
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Re: Rubber bullets
Reply #6 - Jan 28th, 2012 at 3:25pm
 
Over the years various police departments have deployed rubber rounds or bean bag rounds; usually at "civil unrest" type incidents where the use of deadly force is not justified.
Some times they work.....some times they do not!

They have also been deployed at incidents where a person is armed with a club or bat. However, at these incidents, the "less lethel" peson is always backed up by a person armed with a "real firearm".

Rubber rounds and bean bag rounds might work well for discouraging the bear from getting in your garbage cans.. Grin.... but I would not waste my time with them on an intruder.   
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M1911A1 Steve
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Re: Rubber bullets
Reply #7 - Jan 28th, 2012 at 5:20pm
 
Stingray wrote on Jan 28th, 2012 at 3:25pm:
...Rubber rounds and bean bag rounds might work well for discouraging the bear from getting in your garbage cans...

There's nothing wrong with prime cuts of garbage-fed bear. And think of how warm that fur-skin would keep you during the winter. (Just stay away from the liver: too much Vitamin A.)

I cannot think of any civilian use for beanbags and rubber bullets.
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Steve
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chabd
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Re: Rubber bullets
Reply #8 - Jan 28th, 2012 at 9:28pm
 
When the British Army used rubber bullets in Northern Ireland, they had to bounce the round off the ground/road/pavement, firing directly at a person could/would kill them.  I don't know the constructoin of the rounds used, or the firearm used to shoot them.
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M1911A1 Steve
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Re: Rubber bullets
Reply #9 - Jan 28th, 2012 at 10:37pm
 
chabd wrote on Jan 28th, 2012 at 9:28pm:
When the British Army used rubber bullets in Northern Ireland, they had to bounce the round off the ground/road/pavement, firing directly at a person could/would kill them...[emphasis added]

Body billiards: Eighth rubber ball in the corner Irishman...  Grin
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Steve
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Stingray
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Re: Rubber bullets
Reply #10 - Jan 29th, 2012 at 4:06pm
 
Most training on "less then lethal" rounds mandate that you do NOT shoot a person in the head, chest, groin or spine.

Shots to other areas constitute lethal force.

Which pretty much only leaves the arms, legs and butt.  Grin

Pretty tough to only hit the "approved areas" on an agitated or moving subject. That is why most police departments in the US do not use them.
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Re: Rubber bullets
Reply #11 - Jan 31st, 2012 at 5:47pm
 
old codger wrote on Jan 27th, 2012 at 11:45pm:
Heard a story on the TV news tonight of a home owner in Portland who shot a late night visitor with rubber bullets from his shotgun cause he didn't want to kill anybody.  He said the first three rounds were rubber and the next were full 12 ga buckshot.  Interesting story. 

This was a local story for my neck of the woods.  The guy was interviewed on channel 12.  (KPTV)  He said when the suspect ran at him, he fired one of his rubber pellet rounds at him, but the guy didn't even break stride and ran right past him.  The police found him a few blocks away, and he had only a minor injury by maybe one pellet. 

Firearms are not something to be kept on hand to scare anyone, or try to rehabilitate them.   His first 3 rounds of his shotgun are rubber pellets, the next three, 00 buck lead.  If the prowler had his own gun this story would have a very different outcome.   If anyone wants to just scare someone, use a Louisville Slugger. 
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Re: Rubber bullets
Reply #12 - Jan 31st, 2012 at 5:56pm
 
That gentleman was extremely lucky... rubber bullets in a self-defense firearm are folly to the extreme.
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